At this year's Women In Music Awards, we celebrated the achievements of 13 game-changing executives and artists as the industry came together to honour their work. Music Week has spoken to all 13 winners to tell their stories.
Words: Anna Fielding
Ever since Emma Bownes joined The O2 in 2010, the executive tells Music Week, she has been trying to create “a culture of demonstrable gratitude”.
“What we really try to recognise is, that when promoters put a show into The O2, we demonstrate to them and the artists that we are grateful,” Bownes says. “Because there are other options. They could play stadiums, Wembley Arena, Ally Pally, multiple nights at Hammersmith Apollo, or a festival. Also, we know promoters are taking financial risks, so it’s important to me that we don’t just act like a receiving house.”
Bownes explains that, when an artist first plays the Greenwich dome, they are given an award that uses material from the roof, salvaged after it blew off in 2022.
“We also have the 21 club, so when an artist has played 21 times, we give them a key to the venue,” Bownes adds. “Prince got one back in 2007, Michael McIntyre made it into a joke where he was on-call for the fire alarm. We’ve also got a promoter Wall Of Fame backstage, which is about saying thank you to promoters who have put 10 or more shows into the venue.”
As VP, programming, Europe, at AEG Europe & The O2, Bownes is responsible for programming, developing, and curating AEG’s European venues. The executive also serves on the board of the Music Venue Trust and, in recognition of her impact on the live sector, won the Live Music Inspiration Award at Women In Music 2024.
In celebration of all her achievements, Music Week meets Bownes to delve deep into the live sector’s biggest issues, from rising costs to sustainability, and find out more about the driving factors behind her success…
How do you feel about winning a Women In Music Award?
“Surprised, shocked and really very grateful. It really means a lot to me, especially when I look at the previous winners, women I know in the industry like Kelly Chappel and Natasha Bent. They are both incredible. The way they conduct themselves in the industry is something that I aspire to. I’m very happy to be included in that kind of company.”
Many women who work in live music have told Music Week there are additional challenges, whether that’s the remnants of sexism or the combination of childcare and unsocial hours. What’s been your reality?
“Looking back around 20 years, I was a promoter, I’d been working in the industry for five years. I feel that there are some elements of sexism that still exist, but I feel like I suffered from that a lot more when I was early on in my career. I hope that’s a sign things are changing. I would categorise myself as Generation X, but when I look at the two generations below me, the millennials and the Generation Zs, when I talk to the promoters and the agents, I feel that their attitude to women is different, a lot better and more inclusive. When I have interactions with the men on the programming team or the marketing team I see that they call out sexism, a lot more than my generation did. In terms of being a working mum, I feel lucky that I work for the company that I do because they’ve always been really supportive about flexible hours and that’s got to be appreciated. I worked late at the Jonas Brothers, for example, but the next day I left early because I had to take my son to football. I’m grateful because I’m not sure all employers are like that. My husband also works odd hours, making sound effects for film and TV, so he’s flexible too and we cover each other.”
There needs to be some support for women in the industry and for parents, male and female
Emma Bowne, AEG Europe & The O2
Do you think women in the industry need additional support?
“I think we still do. I think things are getting better but that doesn’t mean we’re in a situation where there’s parity. I read somewhere that, across all industries, women’s pay is still an average of 14 per cent behind men’s. I don't think we're at a situation where women and men are entirely treated the same, so there still needs to be some support for women in the industry and for parents, male and female.”
On a personal level, how do you think you have changed as an executive during your time in the industry?
“Time gives you different abilities. I think as you get older, and I don’t know if this is just a female thing, but you certainly give less of a shit about what people think. When I started as a manager I was more cautious, I was trying to ‘act like a manager’. The impetus was always to be professional, or what was called professional then. So I would question myself when I treated my team differently to the way teams were treated by others. Time has given me the confidence to act in the way I think is best. I hope my team agrees with me on this, but I try to create a culture where we behave as if we are all in the same band or playing on the same football team. I once read a music manager say that he would tell his band, ‘It needs to be you against the world’ and I wouldn’t take it that far, but you do need to be a gang, a unit and I might need to be slightly outside of that unit. We’re tight and we’re supportive and it’s not a hierarchy, although ultimately the buck still stops with me. There are people in the team who are better at some aspects of the job than me and it’s important that I let them get on with that and that I don’t micromanage. And whatever you do, you should never take credit for someone else’s work. If anything, the amount of time I’ve spent in the industry has gotten me to a point where I know how I want to run things and it might not be the archetype or the old-fashioned way, but it’s how I think it should be done.”
What do you feel has been your biggest success of the last 12 months?
“I’m really excited about the number of new artists that we’ve had through The O2. We’ve had over 40 artists who have never played our arena coming through in the last year. There are obviously some issues in the live sector. I sit on the board of the Music Venues Trust and I’ve worked at two venues which have closed. So, even though I work here, at one of the busiest music venues in the world, I know how it feels to give your all to a venue and the significant pain when it closes. So sitting on top, at the arena level, it’s amazing to see so many artists coming through. Raye was a first time artist for us this year and was so incredibly good. Olivia Rodrig was incredible. She played an incredible residency. The residencies are another thing I am very proud of - The Killers were one of the best runs we’ve had this year. And I love the gigs that attract a young female demographic, often coming with their mums. They know all the words and they scream them out. And they have this lovely culture and community where they arrive early and they’ve all in their t-shirts and they will sit and chat to each other and sing.”
Even though I work at one of the busiest music venues in the world, I know how it feels to give your all to a venue and the significant pain when it closes
Emma Bownes, AEG Europe & The O2
Can you expand on why you think The O2 is important to the music industry?
“It’s a great size venue to have in London. This is obviously a key market for any artist touring outside of the US and our capacity of 20,000 is perfect for that. We also make sure we have really strong ties to our community. The Young Voices shows are a perfect example of that. Since we opened, we’ve had over half a million children from the local area come and sing in our venue. We also started to sponsor schools so that those that cannot participate in the Young Voices programme can now afford to. Other venues around the country have now started sponsoring schools for Young Voices too, as have companies like PRG who provide our rigging. One of the first schools we sponsored made a video - and this would genuinely make anybody cry - one of the kids says, ‘Things like this don’t happen to schools like ours,’ and no, it often doesn’t. But why the hell shouldn’t it? It’s the happiest show you can ever experience, watching these children sing with their mates.”
Emma Bownes on stage with her brother Tom, a promoter, who introduced her at the Women In Music Awards
How has The O2 changed under your stewardship?
“Well, I’m not sure what was there before I arrived, so I don’t want to take credit for everything. But one thing I have tried to create since I came here in 2010 is a culture of demonstrable gratitude. We could set on our laurels and say ‘Well, shows have to play London and we’ll take it.’ But I think what we really try to recognise that when promoters put a show into The O2 we demonstrate to them and the artists that we are grateful. Because there are other options. They could play stadiums, they could play Wembley Arena. They could play Ally Pally. They could play multiple Hammersmiths. They could play a festival. Also, we know promoters are taking financial risks, to pay the artist, to put the show on. It’s important to me that we don’t just act like a receiving house. When an artist first plays here, we give an award to them and to all of their team. If you remember the storm that blew part of our roof off? Someone fished it out of the Thames and we created an award that is sustainable, our designers are very keen on talking about the jesmonite material, and it uses part of the tapestry of the roof. We also have the 21 club where an artist has played 21 times, we give them a key to the venue. Prince got one back in 2007. Michael McIntyre made it into a joke where he was on-call for the fire alarm. We’ve also got a promoter Wall Of Fame backstage, which is about saying thank you to promoters who have put 10 or more shows into the venue.”
You’ve mentioned your work with the Music Venue Trust. How do you feel about the future of small venues?
“It’s complicated work to try and get buy-ins from every stakeholder in the industry to come together and create a pipeline of investment, not just for the Music Venue Trust, but for everyone who needs it. But what does give me optimism are the people who are involved and trying to sort things out. Mark [Davyd] and Bev [Whitrick], at the Music Venue Trust, they’ve done everything they can to try and highlight the pressures on grassroots venues. It’s incredible that we are all talking about it, they’ve achieved a lot. And look at the Coldplay announcement. I think it’s incredible that they are going to give 10% of the proceeds from some of their live shows. They’ve got all the promoters involved, so that’s SJM, Metropolitan, Live Nation all contributing. And look at Snow Patrol, they’ve included a donation to the Music Venue Trust across their arena tour. It is complicated. But you’ve got to have hope.”
Everyone who works in live is talking about rising costs. Is the sector economically sustainable?
“I think what concerns me most about all of that is the impact on ticket prices. Ticket prices rising to offset those, what does that mean? Will everybody have fair access to the gigs they want to see? Genuinely, that concerns me. When I look at what we have coming up across various genres, shows are continuing to sell out. Arijit Singh, Jonas Brothers, Asake, Aventura, Linkin Park... That gives me hope, that strength across genres.”
What would you like your legacy to be?
“I really want to inspire managers to create that inclusive and supportive culture. What I genuinely hope is that when people work at The O2 or O2 Europe and then move on, that they take the culture of mutual support and the ethos of encouragement with them.”
Click here for more from Women In Music 2024.
